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Irmftan, my concern would that XOOPS will become too chaotic, where one part won't work with another, and there will be a lot of compatibility issues, and we'll be spending more time fixing things introduced by an outside module than on improving XOOPS.

I'm with you to keep core light, but I would suggest to include the most important functionality inside the core, so we can ensure that XOOPS works out of the box.

But what are the "Best in class" practices? How is Drupal, Joomla, and some other up and coming CMS systems dealing with it?

And what kind of experience are the users looking for ?

My personal opnion.

Private Message Is a central point of communication between the user and the site. I am sure that this is important, there are many other things that can be controlled and administered by modules and extensions, but this sector is vital to the system as a whole.

Even if there modules which perform the function to improve functions of the private message, some supplements can be added transparent. See the case in the module yogurt Network for example.

With skill, good will, can go very far.

Ok, regarding on keeping the core light? How light is light? Which parts of the system to you butcher to get the core light? So what do you designate as part of the core and not part of the core?

I'm sorry, but part of the reason XOOPS is in the mess it is now, is due to this 'lets dump everything out of the core' and the reason people choose Joomla, Mambo and Drupal before they will choose Xoops, and this is a fact.

One of the downsides of XOOPS is the failing to understand what should be core and what shouldn't. Users should be given choice agreed, but not on the back of losing more functionality within Xoops.

Sure lets make Private message system a module and give users a choice, but the fact is that 'This' Module should be shipped as part of the core and not as a seperate download on someone else’s website and it should still be maintained as part of the core.

Lets look at this situation of XOOPS as far as content is concerned. I believe that CMS stands for Content Management System and NOT Core Management System. As far as XOOPS is concerned, I would say Zero functionality out of the box. Yet, other systems like Joomla and Drupal for example, can start adding content straight out the box and I believe one of the winning points.

Lets look at the situation of modules for XOOPS right now, and before we start, lets not bring into focus the more exotic modules used, but lets look at what we would consider as the 'Required' just to start with. Most of these required modules are just being developed by a handle full of developers and what if they were to stop developing for Xoops?

We have seen of the last year or two a spate of incompatible, incomplete and dead modules available just from the XOOPS site. Ask most users of XOOPS who spend countless hours looking for modules and ask them about their frustration when:

a) The module doesn't work with any version of Xoops.
b) Has serious bugs and the module is no longer active.
c) Trying to get support of a module and finding the module is no longer active.
d) Trying to submit new features or changed functionality.

Most of the modules people regard as 'required' are over 4 years old and some people won’t keep a 'car' that long before getting a new one.

Personally after 7 years of using XOOPS and seeing nothing really change as to new feature and spending hours of looking for modules, hack and fixes that should have been part of the core years ago and hoping the next version doesn't break those.

Things that should be introduced into XOOPS ASAP:
1. Content Management System: Content out of the box, no need to hunt for modules or hacks. Sections, Categories and Articles. Tied into this you could have links, downloads, reviews etc.
2. Menu Management System: Tied into many of the area' of Xoops. Yes like those ones in Joomla and drupal from the word go. Giving the user the ability to create their own or change the system ones.
3. Better Module Management.
4. Better User Administration.
5. Multi Language Interface.
6. Better Administration features.

I could go on and on, but the fact is that we don't need to be taking things out. We need to be putting the right things in and keeping them up-to-date, compatible and give developers better API to adding these new function and features to their own modules.

John

Well said, John. I hope, Release 3.0 will address these and many other issues.

We need to work on the "out of box" user experience.

We might have to redesign the kernel, but if we do it right, even with more functionality, it could be more responsive than it is today. Thankfully, there are tons of CMS systems out there, so we can take a look at them to see what they do right and incorporate their Best Practices into XOOPS 3.0

I don't much about the kernel itself (I leave it for the experts), but I'm big on user experience, so I'll be looking after that...

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I agree.

I think that there should be a "basic" download as now for those who know what they are doing with xoops, but new users would be better attracted to us if there were a small number of packaged downloads (say 3 or 4) available with a range of current modules ready to install. Not installed, just there, ready and waiting in the "modules" directory.

I also think that we could remove one new users' headache by having the install process prepare and configure the xoops_trust_path as standard. Other xoops-based systems *coughs loudly* are doing this - can't be that hard, can it?

Anyway, back on topic - if this were to go to a vote I'd say "go with Catz's improvements and make it part of the core".

Can't wait to see John's system

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I think, DJ mentioned that this will be part of the future releases.

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Actually it is already in 2.30

thank you catwolf.....this is exciting..i vote for it to be included in the core...

Core Module? Shipped with the core, developed with the core but installed as a module.

Then if someone wants to use an alternative or hack it they won't be affected when a new core comes out.

So when you download XOOPS you get the core + the core modules.

update ?