xoops forums

irmtfan

Module Developer
Posted on: 2008/1/26 16:36
irmtfan
irmtfan (Show more)
Module Developer
Posts: 3419
Since: 2003/12/7
#1

define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Kris_fr as the leader of the "Desgin Team" introduce 3 template as a standard for the XOOPS Theme Contest.

please discuss about it here.
just note that do it in the professional way.

irmtfan

Module Developer
Posted on: 2008/1/26 16:44
irmtfan
irmtfan (Show more)
Module Developer
Posts: 3419
Since: 2003/12/7
#2

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

IMO we must have Standard Codes for themes to have a kind of harmony.

because:
- new developers can understand it better.
- we can follow forward more easy because we get agreed about past.
- changing in themes would be more easy for novices.

but there is still one question:
do you have to accept kris standards?
i would say no.
but i should add instantly. if you cant accept please explain your idea and your standards.

as i said in the comments all developers used to admit some codes like .footer so why we cant define more?

just waiting for your reply.

incama

Friend of XOOPS
Posted on: 2008/1/26 16:51
incama
incama (Show more)
Friend of XOOPS
Posts: 513
Since: 2003/10/24
#3

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Well okay,.as Will already said, it is not a contest, but more a "choose the right color that look nice in my morphthing" (which give me phpnuke dejavu's as people were able to change bgcolor1,.. etc with ease)

Kris then gives indeed a few (10 I believe) themes made with the morphthing as an example that people are willing and able to make nice themes using his templates (well, he doen't tell that the're almost all build by himself). So yes, the contest is a farce with a total lack of freedom, freedom designers need(!) to put their minds on paper and code.

Just my two cents, and btw, don't react BS as you don't make sence to me, and I will ignore you for sure.
Webdesign
Sitting Ducks?!
I hate politics, give me a stylie instead...

incama

Friend of XOOPS
Posted on: 2008/1/26 16:55
incama
incama (Show more)
Friend of XOOPS
Posts: 513
Since: 2003/10/24
#4

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Lol,.did you change the title of this thread as it was once a discussion about the theme contest!
Webdesign
Sitting Ducks?!
I hate politics, give me a stylie instead...

kris_fr

Theme Designer
Posted on: 2008/1/26 19:48
kris_fr
kris_fr (Show more)
Theme Designer
Posts: 1009
Since: 2005/12/31
#5

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

hi,

irmtfan wrote :
Quote:
do you have to accept kris standards?

They are not "my" standards, but those definite since more than one year for xoops.
What call “standard”, for me it is only the naming of the class and id and them smarty balises.
The rest is only of the addition or the positioning of blocks and contents.
The 3 templates themes (soon 4) are only elements to facilitate the design of the themes.

incama wrote :
Quote:
So yes, the contest is a farce with a total lack of freedom, freedom designers need(!) to put their minds on paper and code.

Freedom exists completely, which we want is only the respect of the naming of the class and id, as well as the smartys balises.

@++

kris_fr

Theme Designer
Posted on: 2008/1/26 20:11
kris_fr
kris_fr (Show more)
Theme Designer
Posts: 1009
Since: 2005/12/31
#6

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Just look "default" theme in XOOPS 3.0 (ex 2.3) for code, class and id

@+

stefan88

Community Support Member
Posted on: 2008/1/26 20:53
stefan88
stefan88 (Show more)
Community Support Member
Posts: 1085
Since: 2004/9/20
#7

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Are there any themes submited yet?
..

Marco

Home away from home
Posted on: 2008/1/26 21:24
Marco
Marco (Show more)
Home away from home
Posts: 1256
Since: 2004/3/15
#8

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

Quote:

stefan88 wrote:
Are there any themes submited yet?

very good question !
and i hope designers will post a screenshot for each of their creations into this forum !
who will be the first poster ?
Do synergy or die.

Sublime

Just popping in
Posted on: 2008/1/26 23:42
Sublime
Sublime (Show more)
Just popping in
Posts: 99
Since: 2006/5/23
#9

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

First of all, I absolutely refuse to base anything off of those themes. They are so weighted down with useless code and oversimplification that its just not worth it to make that a template for a future theme. It seems that someone is compensating for lack of graphic ability with an overly excessive amount of code. As I said many times before, I'm not theming via _INSERT_THEME_IMAGE_HERE_ just because "John Doe Team Leader" says I have to.

I refuse to accept "you have to code this way because its easy for new designers to understand". That has got to be the most ridiculous thing ive ever heard in my life. If you can't figure out how to make your theme work and you can't ask someone to explain it to you or code it for you, then you have no business making a theme in the first place. I'm not "noobing-up" my themes so that Jim Bob Newbie can understand how to make his own. I'm not here to teach the world, I'm here to make themes. If a new designer wants to learn how to theme for XOOPS he can go look at the default theme just like anyone else with common sense would do. Perhaps this is why XOOPS rarely has _new_ themers...or themers with any noticeable talent aside from "lookie i made my header blue!" because its too much of a pain in the ass to make a XOOPS theme that doesn't make devs head's spin because you didn't use THEIR code. You have been trying to force this "morpho-template" for how long? I don't see a line of new designers flooding in, eager to make uber themes based off of it.

You guys go ahead and theme-by-numbers, have fun with it, but count me out.

Quote:
but i should add instantly. if you cant accept please explain your idea and your standards.

1. Does't "break" anything in XOOPS or limit its functionality
2. W3C compliant
3. Doesn't hack the core

I do agree that certain CORE css classes should be kept compatible for use (even, odd, row1, row2, etc...). That only makes sense so that ALL modules look good with your theme. But the problem with that is that quite a few nameless module developers insist on hardcoding classes in awkward places (a forums module i currently use hardcoded even/odd/row1/row2 randomly on everything and makes for horrible theming). One of the biggest flaws i've seen isn't in the theming engine, it's in quite a few module developers inability to place css functions properly so that a theme "fits it"....so the themers just try to make due with what we have to work with. However I don't think you should be given a css file and told: "here change these to make your theme".

Which brings up another problem that theres 5600 different modules that do the exact same thing and NONE of them use even/odd/row1/row2/etc in the correct places. I can make my CBB forums look snazzy with a theme, but someone installs my theme on their site & they use d3 or newbb etc etc, and my theme looks like shyte on it.

What you NEED to do is set standards for css classes used in module/block code, or make a wrapper for them like every other cms on the planet, THEN let the themers adapt to those, THAT way when I set something to row1 it's going to look right in every module and I don't have to sit here and template override every #OOPS#ing module. But sadly none of that will ever happen even though it makes MUCH more sense than the current system...themers/module devs are lesser mortals, their ideas matter not.

Stop trying to put shackles on themers, get your code straight first, then talk to us to make it look pretty.

PS: This is the part where kris says: "I'm right you're wrong and theres nothing you can do about it because I'm the Design Team leader, muahahaha"

Burning

Theme Designer
Posted on: 2008/1/27 11:20
Burning
Burning (Show more)
Theme Designer
Posts: 1163
Since: 2006/8/22
#10

Re: define Standard Templates for theme developers - your idea

hi,

Quote:
What you NEED to do is set standards for css classes used in module/block code, or make a wrapper for them like every other cms on the planet, THEN let the themers adapt to those, THAT way when I set something to row1 it's going to look right in every module and I don't have to sit here and template override every #OOPS#ing module.

... it will be wonderful !
How could it be done ? In your opinion, module developpers' have to change all their templates ? ...I really try to understand, because (for me) it's a "nightmare" to obtain same looking for each modules (e.g. here / downloads here)

Another question : Morphothings as you called it is really a bad thing ? Newbies have the right to learn (I'm sure you're agree with it) but do you know another tools ?

I think there is a lack of documentation about themes : for end-user, and may be for module developpers (css classes to use, etc...).


@+

ps : I'm not a designer, just a end-user that do not want to pay for themes
Still learning CSS and... english