41
draj
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 6:55

  • draj

  • Quite a regular

  • Posts: 271

  • Since: 2005/6/23


Hi Marco,
Quote:

Marco wrote:
will you stop wasting your time with titles and honoric positions?


So do you think that I am wasting my time to object against the tactics of DJ? If I did not object and bring things to its required clarity, which perhaphs DJ did not expect, what would have happened? How many people have left XOOPS or did not like DJ's to work with him?

So to make it very clear: There is no play or a game of titles or positions but a very clear signal that such methods must stop and there needs a change.

And marco, if you do not support the objection by myself, then you are supporting DJ's position and also thereby supporting indirectly the manner in which he blocked Akitson and Tom. Is that what you intend to?

Quote:

please add tom if he's willing to help somewhere in the organization. it's not time to loose volonteers if they are skilled for the work they want to work on.
the XOOPS community is asking for move, not titles.
MOVE !
marco


You are wrong, if I may respectfully add!

Tom was invited by himself i.e. DJ in the temporary council. What happened? Was he able to function in the manner as an appointed temporary member? According to DJ Rules of Membership, he appointed tom. But he could not do anything.

The same happens with other council members, who are now in the council. They will never have their say so long DJ has a full dictatorship and command over them. History will repeat like it did with tom.

DJ appointed, through his play of invitees council, other members in the council and declared in the same manner like he did for tom. DJ appointed Tom into the council but he could not do anything in there.

Further, does Tom have any realistic chance to be in the council, as a community member, to work with DJ, if he was not allowed to work in the past?

If Tom is nominated in the Council by the community or applies for it, will DJ accept his application? I refuse to beleive tht Tom has the slightest interest, although I do not know, in aquiring any position or title.

Why should DJ have powers to refuse XOOPS community services offered by Tom?

Why should DJ have powers to refuse XOOPS community services offered by Akitson?

Why should DJ have the sole autorisation of refusing the official recognistion of rejecting a well founded and composed Module Development Team?

Why should DJ have the capacity to reject the official status of Communication Team?

Why should the other four team members have the right to neglect the existance of both the above mentioned teams?

Why should the XOOPS community be thrown in the hands of a one-man-show at all times?

Needless to mention here, that it was a high time for a change and it is already too late.

42
Shine
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 7:19

  • Shine

  • Just can't stay away

  • Posts: 822

  • Since: 2002/7/22


No offence, but I think it is time that DJ/Phppp steps into this discussion and provide some public answers/explanation(s), before this discussion can go (if needed) any further.

At least I am eagerly waiting to read his writing.......

43
draj
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 7:58

  • draj

  • Quite a regular

  • Posts: 271

  • Since: 2005/6/23


Hi,

It has been truely difficult for me to understand what intellectual reason had DJ to lay those Membership rules of dominance, much worse his successfully won support by his supporters.

Quote:

Shine wrote:
No offence, but I think it is time that DJ/Phppp steps into this discussion and provide some public answers/explanation(s), before this discussion can go (if needed) any further.


He already answered!!! He already has put forward a superficial but official defence in the past, which is as follows:

Quote:

DJ wrote
Hi draj,
First, the module development team is considered as a community driven team, please check the article: https://xoops.org/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3820

So the XOOPS Project Team as well as XOOPS Project Council is to be considered as core Programmers driven or dominated!

Even if I follow this logic, I cannot still swallow, why on earth the Main programmer should have any right to reject any community member in the Project Council!

The fact is that he actually did!!!

Quote:

Second, the module development team has never been announced officially yet and all rights assigned to the team leader candidate were temporary.

Yes, the rights assigned to Tom and Akitson were temporary and were revoked according to the moods, will and wishes of DJ, as reported.

Yes, it is true that he did not announce it as an official team. This announcement is to be based on his moods, will and wishes.

So all the council members requires an explaination as to why only four teams were announced to take its formal position and why were the other two teams blocked from taking any official status, activity or work?

So all the work Tom did was put by a click into garbage! Why should others work here then?

The other four council members also have to offer an explaination of DJ's original and official announcement of a XOOPS Project Council comprising of all the respective Team Leaders and why they themselves, except StudioC, wantered to enter the Council with full knowledge that there were teams already formed and Leaders were chosen!

This was a concious act and not a dream!

Quote:

Third, as stated in the article, new team can be created or tuned in the future in case necessary. If you think the module development team is more of a Project team than of a community driven team, please make your proposals.

Why does DJ want a new Module Team and a new Communication Team? I do not understand.

I have nothing to propose, my friends. The proposal came from DJ himself.

44
incama
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 8:21

  • incama

  • Friend of XOOPS

  • Posts: 513

  • Since: 2003/10/24


Quote:
And marco, if you do not support the objection by myself, then you are supporting DJ's position and also thereby supporting indirectly the manner in which he blocked Akitson and Tom. Is that what you intend to?


Isn't that a famous quotation of George W Bush? If you're not with, you're against us!

edit: spellcheck
Webdesign
Sitting Ducks?!
I hate politics, give me a stylie instead...

45
gtop00
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 8:41

  • gtop00

  • Friend of XOOPS

  • Posts: 498

  • Since: 2004/11/13


I really did not want to be involved more in this 'war' but I think that some things have to be resolved.

Dear draj,

1. Who nominated you to represent all those for you are talking on their behalf (Tom, akitson, James,…). Don’t they have their own voice?
2. Why you are spamming the Comments and the Forums with the same subject? You don’t agree with phppp and his actions and we have all understood it.
3. Do not make Democracy lessons here. We all have our stance on what is happening here. We are not idiots.
4. Do not speak about Dictatorship either. If it was so, you should afraid even to speak or write freely.
5. This is not your country’s elections. It is a usual Open Project based on volunteers work. If you have any proposal, present it in the Forums.
6. I agree with you on the “Module Development Team” issue. There are many ways to have a team: a) take the initiative to invite people and organize the team, or b) let the Project Council to assign it, or c) let the people to self organized. When the situation permits and when the team is well established and has presented its work, ask for a leadership role and participation in the P.C. Be sure that the whole community will support it.
7. Do not blame any volunteer for any of his actions. If you don’t like, don’t follow.
8. Let the project continue NOW -by any means- and when the time comes (when we see progress) then, me and many others, will join your efforts for a Democratic or whatever system needed for an appropriate project management.
9. DO NOT FORGET THAT PRIMARILY WE HAVE TO HAVE THE PROJECT ALIVE and this is what we hope with phppp’s intervention.
10. Do not reply to this post. My blood pressure is already high enough (as davidl2’s…) and it may be too pity for our relatives and friends to loose us.
11. Calm down.

46
Shine
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 9:20

  • Shine

  • Just can't stay away

  • Posts: 822

  • Since: 2002/7/22


Quote:
He already answered!!! He already has put forward a superficial but official defence in the past, which is as follows (..)

Oh common Draj, now you are pushing it. That was the first reply of DJ/Phppp. After that a lot of questions have been asked by mainly yourself and some others. These questions haven't been answered yet.
Give it at this moment a go and wait for a further answer/explanation of Phppp/DJ.
After all you keep launching the same questions over and over again, after the first reply of DJ.


Try to be patient and wait for that answer instead of repeately and with full anger replying yourself.

47
Mamba
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 12:08

  • Mamba

  • Moderator

  • Posts: 11377

  • Since: 2004/4/23


Project XOOPS Infrastructure Proposal

JOB DESCRIPTIONS

Director (elected position) - An individual elected to provide leadership to keep Project XOOPS moving forward to fulfill its prime objectives. S/he uses a defined and published plan to help accomplish XOOPS goals. The Director keeps in contact with all Team Coordinators, Project Council members, the Advisory Group and XOOPS members in general. S/he is responsible for supporting all Team Coordinators in effectively leading their teams and delivering agreed upon results. The Director should provide periodic updates to the XOOPS community of XOOPS activities and get involved in its endeavors.

Assistant Director (appointed by Director, subject to approval of Project Council) - An individual who assists the Director in carrying out that person’s duties, helping with communication, standing in for her/him when s/he is temporarily unable to fulfill Director's duties , and performing other mutually agreed tasks.

Project Council – A group of members dedicated to helping XOOPS stay focused and keep in contact with its members. Membership in the XOOPS Project Council is a privilege and is by position within the Project. New Project Council positions may be proposed by existing members, and voted upon by the existing Project Council. Not every project within XOOPS is represented directly on the Project Council. Project Council members, especially the Director, Assistant Director, and Teams Leaders should maintain communications with Team Leaders who are not on the Project Council. At least once a year following the annual election of the new Director, the XOOPS Project Council will examine the entire structure; they will consider if the current structure is effective in helping the Project to reach its goals and recommend required changes.

Project Council Positions for 2007:
• Director
• Assistant Director
• Core Development Team Leader
• Module Development Team Leader
• Design Team Leader
• Documentation and Promotion Team Leader
• Community Coordination Team Leader
• XOOPS Technical Team Leader

Decisions are made by majority vote. Either the Director or Assistant Director may bring up a matter on which the Project Council will vote. Any Project Council member with support from another member may also initiate a vote on any matter. It requires a simple majority of those voting to add or to delete a position/person to the Project Council.


Advisory Group – Well known XOOPS experts will be invited to join this low traffic list to help XOOPS stay in touch with the advancements of XOOPS. This list is by invitation only.


Team Leader – Individuals responsible for maintaining contact with team members and working with team members to establish and follow a plan to accomplish team goals. The Project Council will help team coordinators with planning, implementation, or brainstorming. Each team will establish its own structure to best accomplish its goals. Periodically the Coordinator will provide a status update for the previous month(s) to the Teams Coordinator. The update will include the plan for the immediate future and will be reflected in XOOPS updates.


Elections of XOOPS Director

XOOPS Director is an elected position. The candidate should be a well known individual, accepted by the XOOPS community and an active contributor to XOOPS in the past. Below are the election rules:


- Election every year on the same date (to avoid that it is "forgotten"). Proposed date is:
o Oct. 1st of each year
- The date will be announced/reminded at least a month before the election
- Every XOOPS member should be able to vote - not only Council members.
- XOOPS members should be able to nominate themselves and should be able to discuss the candidates.
- Candidates have to show support of at least two XOOPS members and one Project Council member, before they go on the ballot
- Candidates should create HTML pages stating how they feel they would direct XOOPS. These pages will be placed on XOOPS Web
- We will have one trusted individual as the Election Manager, responsible for correctness of the Elections
- The poll will be anonymous using the standard poll capability of XOOPS. After the poll is closed, the system will generate automatically the results, so there is no possibility to “tamper” with the results.
- The poll will be open for a week to ensure high participation;
- We will run a test before the real elections; so all members will be able to make themselves familiar with the polling features.
- Elections will be decided by simple majority, with minimum of 50 valid votes. If we don't have 50 valid votes, the election will be repeated, and if there is still no result, the Project Council will decide on the new Director
- If there is only one candidate, s/he has to receive minimum of 51% of valid votes. If s/he won’t receive it, the election will be repeated, and if there is still no result, the Project Council will decide on the new Director
- In case the newly elected person does not do their job as expected (or resigns for personal reasons), the Project Council selects a temporary Director, if needed, till the reminder of the cadency.


Proposed Time-line for Director Election (each year)

August 16 - candidates registration starts, election date reminded
August 30 - registration finishes, candidates get their web pages, and discussion starts.
Sept. 14 - elections starts
Sept. 21 - election stops
Sept. 22 - elections results.
Oct. 1 – new XOOPS Director takes the office
Support XOOPS => DONATE
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48
draj
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 16:59

  • draj

  • Quite a regular

  • Posts: 271

  • Since: 2005/6/23


Hi gtop00,

Thieves continue to be robbing until lights are turned on.

DJ is shameless and will not answer. If he does, it will be like a lolipop joke to make some people calm down.

So it is high time even for intelligent people like you to reconsider what you wrote below.

He is adamont about his illigitimate council as seen below:

https://xoops.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=59748&forum=47&post_id=266628#forumpost266628

Sensible people would have reacted a long time ago. He an all his friends are watching this and other messages every day i.e. many times in a day.

Quote:

gtop00 wrote:
I really did not want to be involved more in this 'war' but I think that some things have to be resolved.

49
gtop00
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 18:19

  • gtop00

  • Friend of XOOPS

  • Posts: 498

  • Since: 2004/11/13


Well, since your reply this time is calmer, I will reply too:

I do not have any objection on phppp’s mentioned post. He is actually doing what he was asked to and voluntarily offered: To organize the XOOPS project.

If you, me or anybody else do not fully agree, we all can make our proposals, in a Democratic and constructive way.
ANY proposal can be discussed IN PARALLEL with what is happening now and IF the community agrees, the existing Project Council SHOULD take them in serious consideration FOR THE NEXT re-organization.

Here is mine.

50
Mamba
Re: Call for a community action on Xoops Project Council
  • 2007/7/5 19:25

  • Mamba

  • Moderator

  • Posts: 11377

  • Since: 2004/4/23


Quote:

draj wrote:

Thieves continue to be robbing until lights are turned on.

DJ is shameless and will not answer. If he does, it will be like a lolipop joke to make some people calm down.

So it is high time even for intelligent people like you to reconsider what you wrote below.

He is adamont about his illigitimate council as seen below:

https://xoops.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=59748&forum=47&post_id=266628#forumpost266628

Sensible people would have reacted a long time ago. He an all his friends are watching this and other messages every day i.e. many times in a day.


I think, it's time to calm down and give the people (incl. DJ) a chance to sort things out instead of going on a Jihad against DJ. Accusations won't help. In the past I was impressed with DJ because he delivered his modules w/o asking for anything, and doing all this very quietly in the background. For this he has my full respect.

As with every reorganization, mistakes will be made, as this is a learning process. We, as the XOOPS community, should on one hand support the new team, on the other hand, show them ways to improve. I would like to see you comments as such, but I wish, you would do it in a more professional manner. I didn't see DJ calling you names, so please don't do it to him either!

Finally, let's look at it from the "customer perspective" - if DJ and the team can deliver, then it's better than what we had in the last year or so. So far, he did deliver good quality code with his several modules, so let's give him a chance.
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