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33
Mamba
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/25 20:37

  • Mamba

  • Moderator

  • Posts: 11373

  • Since: 2004/4/23


vaughan,

Linux is not CMS, but it's an Open Source project, the same as XOOPS, so from that perspective it's not much different. As on every project there are developers with egos and the challange is to manage the project in a way that it moves forward.

As you can see from my proposal that I've submitted in early July (see my proposal here), I don't care if the Core developer is the Project Leader or not. But I don't want to exclude him from being the Project Leader. If he has the talent/skills to do it, I don't have any problems with it. And for me, there is no conflict of interests in it.

But I'm looking for a structure that will promote democratic process within the community. Something I definitely don't want to see is somebody self-appointing himself to be the Foundation chair like Herko did. I really would like to reward people doing the work, being loyal to XOOPS, and not people looking just for titles and power.
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34
wizanda
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/25 20:49

  • wizanda

  • Home away from home

  • Posts: 1585

  • Since: 2004/3/21


Required_always 'Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project' =
Quote:
Not people looking just for titles and power.
35
Catzwolf
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/25 22:39

  • Catzwolf

  • Home away from home

  • Posts: 1392

  • Since: 2007/9/30


Quote:

As you can see from my proposal that I've submitted in early July (see my proposal here), I don't care if the Core developer is the Project Leader or not. But I don't want to exclude him from being the Project Leader. If he has the talent/skills to do it, I don't have any problems with it. And for me, there is no conflict of interests in it.


Actually, as someone who has played the part of trying to be lead developer and project manager when I first started Zarilia, yes I was quite easy, but with time and the fact that the project was growing I quickly realised that I could not play both parts and decided to concentrate on the development side and we brought in Ricardo for project management side.

Project leader and core developer is NOT a one man job, and anyone who has ever been in that position will tell you so.

As I said before, delagation is the key part of success in any business or project.
36
skenow
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/26 0:17

  • skenow

  • Home away from home

  • Posts: 993

  • Since: 2004/11/17


My name has been forwarded for nomination and I have been asked to consider and respond - it is a difficult decision, only because of the personal attacks being made.

Any and all personal attacks, insinuations, allegations or rumors must cease before convening any new committee, task force, group or council and undertaking any new initiative.

Until these conditions are met, there will be no progress.

I am withholding my response to the nominations.
37
BlueStocking
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

@SailJapan,

I ACCEPT your nonimation with great pride.

Your proposal is a great step forward, and possibly a light at the end of the tunnel.
____________
@Skenow,
@Vaughan,
This is/was your invitation (aka opportunity) to become a part of the fix, -- don't blow it!!! If it fails (or succeeds) it may be the last chance you will get to let off steam....

Your input is important!
(at least, as important as mine)

...darcy
hhttps://xoops.org/modules/repository .. It is time to get involved - XOOPS.ORG
38
skenow
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/26 0:36

  • skenow

  • Home away from home

  • Posts: 993

  • Since: 2004/11/17


Quote:

BlueStocking wrote:

@Skenow,

This is/was your invitation (aka opportunity) to become a part of the fix, -- don't blow it!!! If it fails (or succeeds) it may be the last chance you will get to let off steam....

Your input is important!
(at least, as important as mine)

...darcy


I am deferring my response until later - the deadline presented to me was October 28th. I was merely stating my assessment of the situation and noting the conditions that will influence my decision.
39
vaughan
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/26 1:06

  • vaughan

  • Friend of XOOPS

  • Posts: 680

  • Since: 2005/11/26


Quote:

BlueStocking wrote:
@Skenow,
@Vaughan,
This is/was your invitation (aka opportunity) to become a part of the fix, -- don't blow it!!! If it fails (or succeeds) it may be the last chance you will get to let off steam....

Your input is important!
(at least, as important as mine)

...darcy


important to who? haven't heard anyone listen so far, y should i expect any different now?

what fix? what committee? a committee for what exactly?

as for invitation, didn't see my name on an invitation. but either way, the 1st thing i'm gonna request is that Damaster be banned. but that ain't gonna happen, so no point in me offering any advice cos i won't be here because of him, so i have no need to fix anything.

i'll just keep coming when the pratts like marco & Damaster appear just to respond to all their false accusations and liableous comments.
40
BlueStocking
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

Vaughan,
THE ORIGINAL POST
Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

Quote:

This document is the first step in this process. If there appears to be broad support for this proposal we will proceed to step 2 (note, a more detailed implementation schedule is included below).
We request community members to submit constructive comments and suggestions on the process for developing a management structure for the XOOPS Project outlined in this document. It must be emphasised that this proposal is simply the starting point for beginning discussions, not the end point.


Believe it or not, if you could actually comment on the content of the original post, I, for one, think IT MIGHT BE, Just might be useful information to consider.
I KNOW your opinion along those lines would be as important to the project as my own. Along with your obvious distaste for other members of the group, you do support a link to xoopsinfo with the statement you support XOOPS over there.

I respectfully request, you support XOOPS over here too or go back to xoopsinfo. Hijacking the work being done here for your own vengeful purposes is not appreciated. (phppp's and SailJapan's efforts at consolidating the proposals)

I am also interested in the welfare of xoops. I could care less about your obsession with ... whoever.
Get on subject or get off the thread.

My opinion....
BS
hhttps://xoops.org/modules/repository .. It is time to get involved - XOOPS.ORG
41
Mamba
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/26 4:44

  • Mamba

  • Moderator

  • Posts: 11373

  • Since: 2004/4/23


catzwolf_ wrote:
Quote:

Project leader and core developer is NOT a one man job, and anyone who has ever been in that position will tell you so.

As I said before, delagation is the key part of success in any business or project.


I agree to the delegation part, so if the Core Developer is a good in delegation, he can be also a Project Leader.

Look, we had Skalpa and Herko in separate positions, and we know the result of it. It didn't work.

Let's not try to make it in stone one way or the other. There are success stories on both sides of the spectrum, as well as failures. In the end, it all comes to the person, and the people who support him. If he gets a good Council doing what they supposed to do, then he'll have less project management work.

If the people on the Council would constantly argue as it is now the case at XOOPS, there will be no progress even with five project managers.

I believe that we should allow anybody (incl. Core developers) to apply for being the project manager, and the community should be able to vote on who they want to see as the XOOPS Project Manager.

Simple and democratic.
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42
Catzwolf
Re: Proposal: Towards A Sustainable Open Source Project

  • 2007/10/26 5:02

  • Catzwolf

  • Home away from home

  • Posts: 1392

  • Since: 2007/9/30


Quote:

Mamba wrote:

Look, we had Skalpa and Herko in separate positions, and we know the result of it. It didn't work.

Let's not try to make it in stone one way or the other. There are success stories on both sides of the spectrum, as well as failures. In the end, it all comes to the person, and the people who support him. If he gets a good Council doing what they supposed to do, then he'll have less project management work.


Sorry Mamba, but with all due respect just because two people fail in many respects does not mean the next two people will do the same. The problem is that people here are unwilling to take any chances on the fact that we have had failures before. Well we might as well packup and all go home and not even bother.

The fact is there have been more council member elected and left than I care to count or remember, if that doesn't tell you something then nothing will. The problem is that the current mandate and policy is so far not bringing this community together but splitting it futher apart. We have a council in direct opposition from a self elected body that will not co-operate with the so called elected bodie of Xoops, doesn't this also tell you something?

Now if the problems were only the day to day running of this project then I may have agreed with you, but the fact is this JOB right now is not a one man task. If DJ wishes to be project leader then I suggest he hires a new lead core developer and concentrate on the task of bringing this project together, code and community wise.

I believe people actually underestimate the severity of the full task here at XOOPS and you all think that by electing a council that all the problems here at XOOPS will just fade away. The problem with XOOPS is that it has always had a weak leadership (Ono not included in this), with no real vision or leadership skills and that is why this project is in a mess.

I have seen many project handled by a project leaders who delegate tasks and is willing to work for the project rather than themselves.

ATB

Catz
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